Diptera.info :: Identification queries :: Diptera (adults)
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 Biblio marci / hortulanus
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 23-10-2005 11:12
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 Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
Hi fly-readers, Yesterday I saw a group (~50-100) of black flies dancing around a dead tree(Dunes/Holland). They stood still in the air with the (quite long) legs hanging downward. I couldn't see any difference in these flies, they all looked quite similar. The flies were black and the wings were very white. Fly-size ~10mm It could be a group of (only male!) flies of Biblio marci or Biblio hortulanus, the female flies look more different in these species. Are there fly-species which look similar to this kind of flies or what kind of fly must I think of? Biblio m. + h. usualy fly from March and April, it is not the time to fly now? I made a picture of one fly, not a very good one, but you can see some of it. best regards, Robert 
Edited by Robert Heemskerk on 23-10-2005 12:53 |
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| Andre |
Posted on 23-10-2005 12:23
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 Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
This probably is Dilophus femoratus, a Bibionid flie indeed. It is much smaller than Bibio marci and hortulanus. Definite identification can be made on a collected specimen (ask Theo or Laurens for example). Greetzz |
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| Mark van Veen |
Posted on 23-10-2005 14:35
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 Member Location: Zeist, Netherlands Posts: 145 Joined: 12.05.04 |
Op waarneming.nl staat een plaatje van D. femoratus met kenmerken: http://www.waarne...hp?id=6358. Mogelijk helpt dat. Als je vrouwtjes goed gezien hebt: hadden ze rode dijen? Dat sluit namelijk de gewone koortsvlieg, D. febrilis, uit. Mark |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 23-10-2005 15:01
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
Yes, I think it where Dilophus femoratus or Dilophus febrilis. I did not see red on the legs, but I did not give attention to this. Indeed, this flies were to small for Biblio marci / hortulanus! To be sure I have to visit them again I think... Maybe I will visit the place again next week. Thanks a lot for your comment! |
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| Zeegers |
Posted on 23-10-2005 17:33
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Member Location: Soest, NL Posts: 18821 Joined: 21.07.04 |
Sorry to spoil the party, but I disagree. There is now way to be sure, but given the picture and the size it is most likely Bibio clavipes (or lepidus). Arguments: size (too large for Dilophus), longer hairs on thorax and the costa seems to be light near the wing tip (not so in Dilophus). Where the hack did I find those features: See link section (my field key to Bibionidae on homepage Louis Boumans, thanks Louis). Did you collect some specimen ? Bibio clavipes would be a nice find ! Theo Zeegers |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 23-10-2005 22:16
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
Ik heb de balonnen en slingers weer opgeruimt hoor! Drankjes zijn in de koeling teruggezet.., Als het morgen een beetje weer is ga ik nog een poging wagen en goed op de Bibionidae-kenmerken letten. Nu maar hopen dat ze er nog zitten. Bedankt voor de zwarte-vliegenlink!, en nog in het Nederlands ook.., dat is fijn.  groet, Robert Heemskerk TRANSLATION: I cleaned up the party decoration! Drinks are back in the fridge. If the weather improves tomorrow I will have another go at them and will pay attention to Bibionidae characters. Let's hope they're still there. Thanks for the March fly link! And in Dutch, too..., that's nice. Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 21:20 |
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| Andre |
Posted on 23-10-2005 23:53
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Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
Nee Robert, dan ook graag een paar v?ngen.. P.S.: Theo, ontwaar ik daar een doornenkrans om tibia I? TRANSLATION: Nr, Robert, you shuld catch a few! P.S. Theo, are those spines on tibia !? Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 21:21 |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 24-10-2005 00:03
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
V?ngen!?.. ..., dan moet ik me eerst verdiepen in wat ze eten en hoe ik ze in leven moet houden!TRANSLATION: Catch them!?.. .., then I will have to find out what they eat and how to keep them alive!
Edited by Paul Beuk on 24-10-2005 21:22 |
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| Zeegers |
Posted on 24-10-2005 09:32
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Member Location: Soest, NL Posts: 18821 Joined: 21.07.04 |
Andre is right ! If you look very closely, you can see a row of spines in the middle of tibia 1. Out of focus, but it is there. This means it is a Dilophus after all. Three species are candidate: there is no way to tell which it might be. Unfortunately, since all three have been recorded from the dune area. The size (about 10 mm.) is most likely somewhat exaggerated. Theo |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 24-10-2005 11:33
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
Yes, it look likes spines. I place a detail of it. No flies today, to much rain!  Robert  |
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| Paul Beuk |
Posted on 24-10-2005 12:06
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 Super Administrator Location: Netherlands Posts: 19375 Joined: 11.05.04 |
What you point out here, actually, appear to me as the tips of the tarsal segments...
Paul - - - - Paul Beuk on https://diptera.info |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 24-10-2005 12:39
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
mmmm, I think the picture is too bad to see these things and must give up! Since so far I didn't know anything about such flies, nice species! Robert, |
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| Andre |
Posted on 24-10-2005 13:54
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Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
Please catch one Robert... we will kill them for you  |
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| Zeegers |
Posted on 24-10-2005 20:40
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Member Location: Soest, NL Posts: 18821 Joined: 21.07.04 |
I was talking about the RIGHT frontal leg. There you can see some structures that may be the Dilophus-spines. Theo |
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| Paul Beuk |
Posted on 24-10-2005 21:24
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Super Administrator Location: Netherlands Posts: 19375 Joined: 11.05.04 |
Hey guys, please keep the English up and not switch to Dutch. There are still people how do not understand Dutch (do not ask me why, though  ).
Paul - - - - Paul Beuk on https://diptera.info |
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| Andre |
Posted on 25-10-2005 00:14
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Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
Thank you, dearest Paul, for translating thumbsup! |
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| Paul Beuk |
Posted on 25-10-2005 07:08
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Super Administrator Location: Netherlands Posts: 19375 Joined: 11.05.04 |
Andre wrote: Thank you, dearest Paul, for translating thumbsup!Wel, you have to take some drastic measures if the non-Dutch speaking members raise there voices (albeit off-line).
Paul - - - - Paul Beuk on https://diptera.info |
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| Andre |
Posted on 26-10-2005 10:43
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Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
The weather will be fine tomorrow Robert |
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| Robert Heemskerk |
Posted on 26-10-2005 12:36
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Member Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands Posts: 2082 Joined: 17.10.05 |
Today I tried to get the car, but I could not get it! (I have to borrow it..) I have to try it tomorrow again.., but that's my father's birthday And when I find these fly, I try to catch one (I will shut my eyes  )What will happen to this fly? Could it by useful for scientific study? regards Robert, |
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| Andre |
Posted on 26-10-2005 23:18
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Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
If you want, you can bring it to the ZMA, Plantage Middenlaan 64. Try to catch two or three... Put them in an empty photofilm-box. Write your name on it, the day and place where you caught them too. Address it to Theo Zeegers and it will get on the right place. Succes! Greetings, Andr |
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