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 Another Cheilosia
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| Juergen Peters |
Posted on 11-05-2006 00:27
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 Member Location: northwest Germany Posts: 13727 Joined: 11.09.04 |
Hello! This female Cheilosia was bigger than the dark one from my last post (about 15 mm). Can it be determined? Found on May-08 at forest edge, Ostwestfalen/Germany. Thanks! Juergen Peters attached the following image:  [22.63Kb] Best regards, Jürgen -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Juergen Peters Borgholzhausen, Germany WWW: http://insektenfo... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= |
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| John Smit |
Posted on 15-05-2006 09:02
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 Member Location: Utrecht Posts: 565 Joined: 05.10.04 |
Hi Juergen, If it really is around 15 mm it can only be either Cheilosia himantopus or C. orthotricha. both are impossible ot distinguish from a photo. John |
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| Juergen Peters |
Posted on 15-05-2006 17:33
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Member Location: northwest Germany Posts: 13727 Joined: 11.09.04 |
Hello, John! John Smit wrote: If it really is around 15 mm it can only be either Cheilosia himantopus or C. orthotricha. both are impossible ot distinguish from a photo. Thanks! It was rather large for a Cheilosia, but let's say: at least 15 mm with wings. Is himantopus an older (or new) name? It is not listed in my "Entomofauna germanica" (also not as a synonym). Or possibly that species does not live here (?). That would make it easier ;-). Best regards, Jürgen -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Juergen Peters Borgholzhausen, Germany WWW: http://insektenfo... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= |
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| lweit |
Posted on 15-05-2006 17:51
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Member Location: France, Département de la Moselle Posts: 609 Joined: 23.12.05 |
In Fauna Europaea, the name is Cheilosia himantopa ? Bye Louis |
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| Andre |
Posted on 15-05-2006 18:54
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 Member Location: Tilburg, the Netherlands Posts: 2111 Joined: 18.07.04 |
Juergen... I advise you to use modern literature. Louis... that is correct. Cheilosia is female, so himantopA is correct.  |
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| Juergen Peters |
Posted on 15-05-2006 20:12
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Member Location: northwest Germany Posts: 13727 Joined: 11.09.04 |
Hello! Andre wrote: Juergen... I advise you to use modern literature. Louis... that is correct. Cheilosia is female, so himantopA is correct. I'm sorry, but in the checklist in "Entomofauna germanica" (latest edition, but already from 1999) there is neither a C. himantopus, nor himantopa. So it is not in the addendum from 2004. Also not listed as a synonym for another species... It says - alphabetically: ... - C. grossa - C. hercyniae - C. illustrata ... In the Syrphid redlist of Lower Saxony (neighbour state) from 1998 it is not listed officially, but proposed to be listed (as new) in future versions. Maybe that species did only recently immigrate to Germany and is therefore not listed in the "Entomofauna", yet? Best regards, Jürgen -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Juergen Peters Borgholzhausen, Germany WWW: http://insektenfo... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= |
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| John Smit |
Posted on 15-05-2006 21:21
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Member Location: Utrecht Posts: 565 Joined: 05.10.04 |
Hi all, In the year 2000(!) Stuke and Claussen published their paper on the Cheilosia canicularis species-complex reinstating Cheilosia himantopus (Panzer, 1798) as a valid species. Years before in 1994 Vujic and Claussen described C. orthotricha from the Balkan. Sorry I can't find the record for Germany in my literature database, but I am convinced it is present in Germany. Both are closely related to C. canicularis. By the way I wouldn't pay too much attention to Fauna Europaea but stick to the published references, this website bulks with errors! John Edited by John Smit on 17-05-2006 20:05 |
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| Jan Willem |
Posted on 15-05-2006 21:41
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 Member Location: Waalwijk, The Netherlands Posts: 2128 Joined: 24.07.04 |
Hi John, Funny you are talking about "referneces" in a sentence about errors . But I encourage you to send your comments on the Fauna Europaea site to the coordinators of specialists and hope that they will be using your input for improving the site!Jan Willem |
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| John Smit |
Posted on 17-05-2006 20:09
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Member Location: Utrecht Posts: 565 Joined: 05.10.04 |
Hi Jan-Willem, I did and I even provided data and references before the site was running, still nothing was done with it. Don't misunderstand me, I think it's a wonderfull initiative and tool! I only wanted to make clear it is no taxonomical source! John |
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| Juergen Peters |
Posted on 18-05-2006 17:27
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Member Location: northwest Germany Posts: 13727 Joined: 11.09.04 |
Hello, John! John Smit wrote: In the year 2000(!) Stuke and Claussen published their paper on the Cheilosia canicularis species-complex reinstating Cheilosia himantopus (Panzer, 1798) as a valid species. Years before in 1994 Vujic and Claussen described C. orthotricha from the Balkan. Sorry I can't find the record for Germany in my literature database, but I am convinced it is present in Germany. Both are closely related to C. canicularis. Thanks! I have been on Stuke's website, and he suggests the species C. himantopus to be listed in the next redlist (as category 3, "endangered"). In the last redlist and checklist(s) is was not contained, although the publication appeared earlier. C. orthotricha is already listed in the "Entomofauna germanica". Best regards, Jürgen -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Juergen Peters Borgholzhausen, Germany WWW: http://insektenfo... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= |
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