Gallery Links
Users Online
· Guests Online: 25

· Members Online: 0

· Total Members: 4,962
· Newest Member: markodraisma
Forum Threads
Theme Switcher
Switch to:
Last Seen Users
· Carnifex00:15:28
· arnaudbdn00:16:58
· evdb00:22:39
· ESant00:35:34
· Igor Grichanov01:03:44
· weia01:24:45
· libor01:35:01
· Mario Renden02:09:33
· smol02:38:31
· Nosferatumyia02:58:36
Latest Photo Additions
View Thread
Diptera.info :: Identification queries :: Diptera (adults)
Who is here? 1 guest(s)
 Print Thread
Ephydridae
serenense7
#1 Print Post
Posted on 01-05-2024 08:20
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

www.galerie-insecte.org/galerie/image/dos341/big/P4278194.JPG
Luc Bettinelli : France : Arc-et-Senans : 25610 : 27/04/2024
Altitude : 236 m - Taille : 5 mm ????
Réf. : 341727


Hello, for this Ephydridae, I think about Scatella paludum , but the opinions I've asked for are not unanimous (Philotelma is suggested, especially because the arista can appear plumose, even if it remains barely visible in the photo).

For my part I rely on habitus, wing pattern (pale spots), dorsocentral and acrostichal setae, colour of body and legs.

What do you think ?

I specify that the photo was taken near an unvegetated pond (Arc-et-Senans, France, april 27, 2024).

Best regards

Luc Bettinelli
 
John Carr
#2 Print Post
Posted on 01-05-2024 14:00
User Avatar

Member

Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 9919
Joined: 22.10.10

According to the revision by Mathis et al. (2009) there is no species of Philotelma with several pale wing spots and entirely dark legs.
 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31715949@N00
serenense7
#3 Print Post
Posted on 01-05-2024 19:19
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Thank you for that clarification.

I based myself on the British key available online from Drake (2006).

I had come to the same conclusion regarding the spots on the wings which didn't seem to me to match Philotelma.

On the other hand, I thought that we could not consider the legs as entirely black here (presence of a silvery pruinosity on part of the legs).


I find this individual very similar to photographs on the web for Scatella paludum, but the impression that the arista is plumose is problematic. Do you think this is a bad lead?

 
John Carr
#4 Print Post
Posted on 01-05-2024 20:09
User Avatar

Member

Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 9919
Joined: 22.10.10

Plumose ordinarily means the hairs on the arista are as long as the width of the third segment of the antenna (to which the arista is attached). I do not see that.

Some species of Scatella have an enlarged pair of acrostichal bristles near the suture, like your fly has.
 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31715949@N00
serenense7
#5 Print Post
Posted on 03-05-2024 00:18
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Thank you for these new interesting elements.


www.galerie-insecte.org/galerie/image/dos341/big/P4278194-2(1).jpg
Luc Bettinelli : France : Arc-et-Senans : 25610 : 27/04/2024
Altitude : 236 m -
Réf. : 341882

Here is a reworked view (photo noise reduction) to better visualize why we thought the arista was plumose. Does this change anything for you?

And what do you think of the Scatella paludum hypothesis? Is this a species that is familiar to you or anyone else, and does this hypothesis seem good to you?
I rely on the arrangement of the spots (for the genus), on the acrosticals and on the erased side of the wing spots and on the silvery pruinosity for the species.
Thank you for your opinions !
Edited by serenense7 on 03-05-2024 13:50
 
serenense7
#6 Print Post
Posted on 04-05-2024 11:01
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Hello, note that I found a reference which describes the arista of Scatella paludum as obviously pubescent
Edited by serenense7 on 04-05-2024 11:02
 
serenense7
#7 Print Post
Posted on 10-05-2024 10:40
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Does anyone have any other opinion on the Scatella paludum proposal? or at least on confirmation of the genus? Frown
 
nielsyese
#8 Print Post
Posted on 14-05-2024 21:54
User Avatar

Member

Location: Yerseke, NL
Posts: 2345
Joined: 13.02.09

It is definitely a Scatella species. The greyish colour and faint wing spots support S. paludum, but I can't confirm the species by this pictures. I do not see any trace of a long haired arista.
Best wishes, Niels-Jan Dek
 
serenense7
#9 Print Post
Posted on 19-05-2024 10:48
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Thank you very much for your response and for this opinion which is in line with what we ultimately concluded !
 
Tony Irwin
#10 Print Post
Posted on 20-05-2024 20:54
User Avatar

Member

Location: Norwich, England
Posts: 7196
Joined: 19.11.04

I would say that the specimen is a little too dark, and the wing markings too clear for it to be paludum. I would suggest this is Scatella lacustris (formerly tenuicosta). Scatella paludum has very silvery pleurae and face (if you have any other photos).
Tony
----------
Tony Irwin
 
serenense7
#11 Print Post
Posted on 26-05-2024 10:32
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

Unfortunately, I don't have any other usable photo, and in particular no photo of the face. But thank you very much for this informed opinion.
 
serenense7
#12 Print Post
Posted on 27-05-2024 11:24
Member

Location:
Posts: 43
Joined: 06.12.15

In the French INPN repository, there is Scatella tenuicosta Collin, 1930 and Scatella stagnalis Fallén, 1813) synonymous with Ephydra lacustris Meigen, 1830. I'm a little lost.


 
Tony Irwin
#13 Print Post
Posted on 13-06-2024 17:16
User Avatar

Member

Location: Norwich, England
Posts: 7196
Joined: 19.11.04

S.tenuicosta is a synonym of S.lacustris. Scatella stagnalis is a good species, and should not be confused with lacustris. It has a very different appearance and structure.
Tony
----------
Tony Irwin
 
Jump to Forum:
Similar Threads
Thread Forum Replies Last Post
Hydrellia sp. (Ephydridae)? Diptera (adults) 1 13-06-2024 20:49
Ephydridae: Hyadina? ID Diptera (adults) 6 31-05-2024 10:08
Ephydridae Diptera (adults) 3 11-04-2024 19:17
Athyroglossa glabra (Ephydridae)? (10.02.24) --> confirmed Diptera (adults) 5 20-03-2024 23:51
Scatella (Ephydridae)? (10.02.24) --> cf. Scatella lacustris Diptera (adults) 4 20-03-2024 23:50
Date and time
17 June 2024 11:23
Login
Username

Password



Not a member yet?
Click here to register.

Forgotten your password?
Request a new one here.
Temporary email?
Due to fact this site has functionality making use of your email address, any registration using a temporary email address will be rejected.

Paul
Donate
Please, help to make
Diptera.info
possible and enable
further improvements!
Latest Articles
Syrph the Net
Those who want to have access to the Syrph the Net database need to sign the
License Agreement -
Click to Download


Public files of Syrph the Net can be downloaded HERE

Last updated: 25.08.2011
Shoutbox
You must login to post a message.

07.03.24 01:01
Some flies preserved in ethanol and then pinned often get the eyes sunken, how can this be avoided? Best answer: I usually keep alcohol-collected material in alcohol

17.08.23 16:23
Aneomochtherus

17.08.23 14:54
Tony, I HAD a blank in the file name. Sorry!

17.08.23 14:44
Tony, thanks! I tried it (see "Cylindromyia" Wink but don't see the image in the post.

17.08.23 12:37
pjt - just send the post and attached image. Do not preview thread, as this will lose the link to the image,

16.08.23 09:37
Tried to attach an image to a forum post. jpg, 32kB, 72dpi, no blanks, ... File name is correctly displayed, but when I click "Preview Thread" it just vanishes. Help!

23.02.23 22:29
Has anyone used the Leica DM500, any comments.

27.12.22 22:10
Thanks, Jan Willem! Much appreciated. Grin

19.12.22 12:33
Thanks Paul for your work on keeping this forum available! Just made a donation via PayPal.

09.10.22 18:07
Yes, dipterologists from far abroad, please buy your copy at veldshop. Stamps will be expensive, but he, the book is unreasonably cheap Smile

Render time: 1.95 seconds | 194,872,256 unique visits