Thread subject: Diptera.info :: Anthomyiidae? Or something like Coenosia?

Posted by Sundew on 09-10-2007 22:03
#1

Hello,
Flies in general get rarer now, but it is the season of small grey ones and brownish ones of different size. Therefore they can be met in several threads, but I do not dare to apply their names to those in my photos. I am too unfamilar with these groups. So I apologize in advance for showing you a fly you may have identified recently. I begin with a small grey one that (to me) bears a certain resemblance to a Coenosia but is obviously not C. tigrina. Is there a name for the little animal sitting on a Berlin park bench?
Thanks, Sundew

Edited by Sundew on 10-10-2007 10:51

Posted by jorgemotalmeida on 09-10-2007 22:23
#2

no... there are plenty of flies yet!! 30 ?C for tomorrow! :D

Posted by Sundew on 09-10-2007 22:37
#3

Jorge: No weather report, ID please! (We have grey days and 14?C, the perceived temperature is much lower. Flies seem to have 6 cold feet, I have 2.)
Sundew

Posted by jorgemotalmeida on 09-10-2007 22:56
#4

Last weekend I was in Serra da Estrela at 1500 m and it was 10 ?C. I could see many flies in spite of the cold. However there was no wind, and sometimes the Sun appeared..

ID - Muscidae, possibly Coenosia, but in this case I'm not sure! Let's go wait for the experts. :)

Posted by Tony Irwin on 09-10-2007 23:17
#5

I'd go for Anthomyiidae on this one

Posted by Sundew on 10-10-2007 00:04
#6

I'd like to follow your thoughts - how do you discriminate between the groups? Can I see typical characters, too, or must I acquire decades of experience first? (I am afraid that's necessary...)
Sundew

Posted by Tony Irwin on 10-10-2007 18:33
#7

All of the pointers have exceptions, of course - that's why dipterology is such a challenge!
Here's a list of features that I noticed -
wings folded across each other, fairly bristly body and legs, orange-coloured anterior frons, dark central line on tergites (but that might be a shadow) - combinations of these features may be found in Muscidae, but overall, this looks like Anthomyiidae to me - of course I might be wrong ! :D

Posted by jorgemotalmeida on 10-10-2007 18:55
#8

usually - there are exceptions - anal veins reaches wing margin for Anthomyiidae, also they are more slender than Muscidae (this is not a good and safe way, just a rule to help...) In first photo (1st column, 1st line) seems that anal vein 1 doesn't reach the wing margin, but I was fooled other times by the tricks of light/flash, so it was more a guess. For me it appears a jizz of muscidae BUT again I'm not expert in these families. I'm still learning, and there is a lot to know in these hell families. :)

Posted by Nikita Vikhrev on 10-10-2007 20:18
#9

wings folded across each other, fairly bristly body and legs, orange-coloured anterior frons, dark central line on tergites (but that might be a shadow)

I'd add proturding mouse - may be in Muscidae, but rare

Posted by Kahis on 10-10-2007 20:44
#10

Hmm, it seems that a bunch of my postings never appeared on the site, or were deleted. Well, here we go (again):

This is probably a female of Botanophila fugax. I would normally not commit to giving species names for females in this family, but
a) B. fugax is very common in the autumn, when rather few common anthomyiids are still flying and
b) by chance I had just looked at a fresh collected specimen before I saw your post.

Edit: There's frost forming on the car roofs on my street :(

Edited by Kahis on 10-10-2007 20:48

Posted by Nikita Vikhrev on 10-10-2007 21:01
#11

Bravo and thank you, Kahis!
I met a lot of this Anthomyiid this autumn, but all females, so I didn't dare to try to ID its.

Posted by Sundew on 10-10-2007 21:15
#12

Well, you are all great! So much accumulated information in such a short time - I am delighted. And Kahis is the best of the team, he offers even a species name. These flies are really frequent now. Today we had a sunny day and the sunlight is still warm; on every sunlit leaf there sat a small grey fly. Possibly not all of them were Botanophila (nice name, "botany lover" - could be mine, as a botanist!), but many looked just like the photographed one. I hope to recognize the species now - until I get my doubts! There are so many species of small grey flies...
Cordial thanks to all of you, Sundew
PS. This night could become frosty, so our weather is more similar to Kahis's than to Jorge's.