Thread subject: Diptera.info :: odd growth on face = sticky substance

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 16:52
#1

Berlin - August

I don't know where to post this query. I don't want to upset anyone by posting here.

I found a Calliphorid with an odd growth around the face. I have no idea what is this growth. Is this a larva/parasite? a birth defect? infection as a result of attempted predation? I don't see thalli so not a fungus?

Any help is appreciated. I cannot find any data about parasites of Calliphorids.

Also, any recommendations regarding dissection. I have no idea where to begin. Maybe just enter from the occiput? I want to preserve whatever it is in the face.

Thank You for your Time and Effort.

Edited by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 18:23

Posted by Tony Irwin on 10-09-2017 17:02
#2

I don't think this is a parasite or an infection - it looks more like something has stuck to the face. Before you start dissection, try washing the head in water or alcohol or acetone. If it's stuck on with sugar, then the water should shift it, if it's some sort of resin, then the alcohol or acetone may work. Either way, I think you will find that the fly is intact and normal under all the gunk.

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 17:16
#3

Hello Tony and Thank You for replying.

I thought so too but I've examined the head in a microscope allready. The soft orange area appears to be attached to the head. I followed it around the face and it disappears around the mouth area. I see hairs growing out from the orange substance. I suppose that it may be a sticky substance stuck to the hairs. I will take your advice and rinse it off in alcohol.

Thanks for your Time. I will update this thread after cleansing the head.

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 17:17
#4

mouth area

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 18:22
#5

so it is some sort of substance. You are correct that the head is normal. The substance was stuck to the antenna and proboscis very well. The antenna and the entire proboscis came off whenever I tried to apply pressure to pull the substance away from the face. I didn't see anything in the alcohol other than tissue and the minerals stuck to the face. I guess this Calliphorid was licking something sticky :)

I've attached some photos. Thank You Sir Tony.

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 18:22
#6

palpi

Posted by johnes81 on 10-09-2017 18:22
#7

antenna

Posted by Tony Irwin on 10-09-2017 21:21
#8

My grandson has a similar appearance when he's eating ice-cream! :D

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 00:41
#9

:D I didn't expect this reply. Good one Sir Tony. I had a nice laugh.
I guess the fly found something delicious and buried its face in the substance.

I'm Thankful for your Time Sir Tony. I wish for you a Pleasant Night.

Posted by Paul Beuk on 11-09-2017 09:25
#10

I think it just was the prilinum that did not set properly on emergence...

Posted by Colobo on 11-09-2017 11:06
#11

Difficult tu tell from the pictures but this remember something I observed some years ago on several Calliphoridae in sorting malaise trap samples. It was pollinic sacs of an orchid stuck to the face and antenna of the flies, in a somewhat different way in each specimen. The pollinic sacs were sticken to the fly face by a kind of short stem. It was obviously resulting of a mecanism of the stamens allowing to use the flies visiting the flowers for carrying the pollinic sacs and ensure distant pollination. Interestingly only calliphorids of genus Onesia had such pollinic sacs sticken on face.

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 12:14
#12

Hello Colobo. I am stunned by your post because I have not read something like this before. I like Calliphoridae but I am not yet scientific about them. I have very little experience with diptera. I've only studied for the past year. I've observed and recorded data for the last four years but this is the first year of proper study for me.

" Interestingly only calliphorids of genus Onesia had such pollinic sacs sticken on face."
I am stunned because you are absolutely correct that this is Onesia and I haven't shown a photo. I've examined three similar species and two are Onesia. I cannot yet place an id because only O. floralis is listed for Berlin area. This fly is not floralis. Dr. Knut Rognes does not have drawings of the ovipositor for austriaca and kowarczi. I can eliminate zumpti because of a Swiss document co-authored by Dr. Knut Rognes. I assume that this fly is austriaca but I intend to write to an expert for help. Mostly because a very similar species matches Bellardia not Onesia. Anyway, this species with the "odd growth" is in fact Onesia.

I suspect that this substance is pollinic sacs but I also think that Sir Paul is correct. I still think that the fly also has a deformation of some sort. I say this because the ovipositor matches Onesia but one of the spermathecae is deformed. I will post more photos here if the interest remains. I would love to read more opinions about this fly.

very interesting posts here. I am excited that my fellow dipterists are interested in this subject. Good stuff :)

I will be back to post some photos...

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 13:08
#13

head 1

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 13:09
#14

head angle 2

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 13:09
#15

face 1

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 13:10
#16

face 2

Posted by johnes81 on 11-09-2017 13:11
#17

spermathecae (ovipositor matches Onesia but this odd spermatheca makes me think that this fly has a birth defect.)

Edited by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:47

Posted by Paul Beuk on 12-09-2017 09:00
#18

The figure of the spermathecae of Onesia floralis in Rognes'book on Scandinavian Calliphoridae shows paired oblong spermathecae and an unpaired, heart-shaped spermatheca.
I cannot discern any pollinaria in your photographs though there certainly is some loose pollen on the head.

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 12:39
#19

Thank You for your Time Sir Paul. I appreciate your comments in this thread.

I have the Blowflies of Fennoscandia and Denmark. I have looked at this fly for days and I cannot agree that it is floralis. I've tried to make it be floralis but no success. I notice that Dr. Rognes mentions that one of the spermathecae has an "abnormal biolbed apex" but it certainly doesn't look like the one in my photo. The spermatheca in my photo is strongly biolobed like a heart shape. Fascinating! I suppose that it could be an extreme abnormality but the ovipositor doesn't match floralis. I conclude that it is Onesia but it looks strange. I wonder if the ovipositor is also an abnormality?

I know that Dr. Rognes mentions the possibility of a weak presutural ia on floralis but how does one define weak? I see a well-developed bristle. The bristle is not strong but it is well developed in my opinion. [attachment will be posted later today]

I will post some photos of all three problematic species. You can see that they all have similarities but nothing is conclusive to floralis. I intend to write to Dr. Rognes about this. Meantime, I'm happy to include everyone with this subject. Thus, I will add some photos here today. Maybe more opinions will help...

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 12:44
#20

"I cannot discern any pollinaria in your photographs though there certainly is some loose pollen on the head."

yes, I agree. I am stumped. I have more photos that show this at different angles. I will post them later today. Maybe we can conclude that this is a deformity. Especially with the spermatheca and the ovipositor not matching. What an odd but fascinating fly!

Posted by Paul Beuk on 12-09-2017 13:31
#21

There are four German species of Onesia...

Posted by Paul Beuk on 12-09-2017 13:38
#22

A paper on Onesia of 1964 by Schumann: http://contributi...d/686/685/

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 21:51
#23

Thank You for the link Sir Paul. Fantastic paper! I tried to find this document before but I couldn't seem to find it using Google. Suddenly it appears in Google searches. Interesting. Thank You very much.

I will still post some photos for you to see. I have three specimens which look similar. One I figure should be Onesia floralis but the hairs on the ovipositor look slightly different than the drawings in the book. The second one looks more like Bellardia, which makes me wonder if it is a different Onesia species. The third is the one here with the deformed spermatheca. Anyway, this document should help alot.

I have separate lists of all diptera for Germany (in text files.) I also look at the red lists for Berlin to determine what is supposed to be recorded for Berlin. Only Onesia floralis is listed for Berlin but I suspect that one of these specimens should be austriaca. The paper by Schumann is a major boost in research. You are Wonderful Sir Paul. Thank You.

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 21:57
#24

this first photo is from the fly in this post with the deformities. The ovipositor is not matching Onesia floralis. I wonder if the ovipositor is deformed/abnormal too?

dorsal sclerites (still attached to the abdomen)

Edited by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:49

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 21:58
#25

ventral sclerites of the same species (still attached to the abdomen):

Edited by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:49

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 22:01
#26

this photo is from the first species of three. This one most resembles Onesia floralis but the bristles and hairs don't match the drawings of Dr. Rognes. I wonder if this is austriaca. The paper that you have provided should help determine this species. Otherwise, I may have to consider Bellardia vulgaris. I will try to key it with both Schumann and Rognes.

Edited by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:49

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 22:03
#27

these are the spermathecae from the same fly which resembles Onesia floralis (species 1 of 3).
I've erroneously typed a positive for floralis in this image. please disregard this note. I meant to type "spermathecae most matches floralis"

Edited by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:48

Posted by johnes81 on 12-09-2017 22:05
#28

this photo shows the presutural ia of species 3 (the deformed fly of this post). Dr. Rognes writes that weak prst ia are possible but I don't think that these hairs/bristles are weak. Besides, the ovipositor doesn't match Onesia floralis.

Posted by johnes81 on 03-10-2017 11:52
#29

Update:

Sir Paul is correct about the ptilinium. Dr. Rognes states the following regarding this species: "Newly hatched, note the exposed, not withdrawn ptilinium".

Further, my Wife and I deduced that these should be Onesia austriaca which is not recorded in Berlin. Dr. Rognes has confirmed that all three species are in fact Onesia austriaca. So we have a first record for Berlin. And now I know what Onesia austriaca looks like.