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I expect all these to be Calliphora vomitoria, but I'm looking for confirmation from experts!

Location: Amstelveen, the Netherlands. Suburban area, all three on Ivy. Date: 8 October 2006.

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and this one,

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and still another one.

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The anterior spiracle is clearly yellow, which indicates C. vicina.

In vomitoria, the beard itself is red.
In vicina, the beard is blackish, however, the gena below the beard in reddish in ground-colour. Which is often misinterpretered as a reddish beard.

So, in my mind this should be C. vicina, but let's wait for Tony.


Theo

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Yes, I'd say they're all C. vicina. The best on-line photo I could find of vomitoria is at http://www.nku.ed...itoria.htm
Note the red beard on a dark face. Hope this helps!

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OK, but this means that the photograph I submitted for the Gallery too might be vicina! Can this be seen from a dorsal shot? (see recently submitted photographs), or are they in effect indistinguishable from this angle?

Thanks all for your input!

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It is not as easy task to make a lateral photo of Calliphora with good visible cheek. This time in Sochi I was very much disappointed that my only photo of C. vomitoria from desirable point is blur:(
But now I decided to submit it just for information what has to be visible (black cheek with red beard).
Nikita

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Cheers;)

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;)

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In Eastern Europe (From Eastern Hungary eastwards) the situation is more complicated than just separating vicina from vomitoria. A third species, C. uralensis is also common, and I wonder how it can be safely told apart from vicina and uralensis (this letter species should have blackish beard), when I struggle to separate these two species already. More and more I start to think that I have not even observed C. vomitoria so far, just vicina and uralensis. I shall post a few images later.

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and Calliphora loewi ...

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Cor - The gallery photo is a bit suspect. I think it is probably vicina - the basicosta is partly pale and the lower calypter has a broad white border). It's certainly not a good picture of vomitoria - (shows none of the key characters) :(
Nikita - your Sochi vomitoria appears to be vomitoria OK, but note the large brush of red hairs at the end of the abdomen. I don't think these are really red - I think they are reflecting the sun, like the bristles on the back of the fore-tibia, the aristal hairs and the fronto-orbitals. So is the beard really red? At least the basicosta and genae ground colour is clearly black, so it can't be vicina;)
Andre's pictures show the hair colour of vicina really well (we can tell they are vicina from that really bright orange anterior spiracle). There are alot of pale hairs extending from the occiput forward on to the lower genae, but the gena itself is pale with dark hairs.
Nikita's lowewi photo is helpful, showing the long antenna of the female and the white spot on the parafacial.
But I give up on the substrate ... rabbit .... mouse....mink.. ???

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Hi Tony.
1. Gallery photo of C. vomitoria - I think so - any doubts regard to credit of more common species - C. vicina.
2. My C. vomitoria was collected. I hoped that it is C. loewi, but alas, beard is red.
3. C. loewi was ID by Andrey Ozerov from my photo from last year.
This year I haven't find dead mouse:(

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P.S. Mouse - Apodemus sylvaticus.

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If Forum decide that it is C. loewi, I will be glad to put image of not as common fly to Gallery.

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Nikita - I think this is loewi. It would be good to have it in the gallery

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Thank you Tony.
Your and Andrey Ozerov confirmations are heavy enought to send image:D
Nikita

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Hello,

Is this also C. loewi? For me, this is whether C. vicina nor C. vomitoria.
According to Fauna europaea, we should have only those three in France.

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Hi Pierre.
Cheeks bicolor - vicina and uralensis;
cheeks black - vomitoria and loewi.
Yours has black/yellow cheek - C. vicina.
Nikita

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Can we agree a final vote on all these pics?;) Robert

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1, 2, 3, 5a, 5b, 6, 10 - vicina
4 - vomitoria
7, 8, 9 - loewi

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No love for C. uralensis - or C. subalpina?

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I think this individual is a female C. vicina. Am I right?

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Lateral view of the individual from the last posting.

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Cheek looks all grey - I think C. vomitoria.
Nikita

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This is an enigmatic fly. I think this is not C. vicina. Is it C. uralensis? Another scenario is that this fly is not even Calliphora, but belongs to another genus.

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A view from the top.

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Xespok - your first fly is Calliphora vicina. The anterior spiracle and the basicosta are pale, and I think the front of the genae are pale too. I can see no red hairs on the genae, so not vomitoria.
Your enimatic fly looks like Protocalliphora or a related species.
[By the way, it may be better to start a new thread with enigmatic flies - there's a danger of getting confused if there are too many species in a thread!]

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Nikita,



My question was mainly about the white strip along the inner part of the eyes. But this should not be a criterion if I understand your answer.

Thanks anyway, as always.

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So, I guess this is C.vomitoria then (reddish beard on dark gena)?


(Clicking the photo will take you to flickr, where you can view all available sizes)

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I filled some doubts about my two years ago C.loewi images among this large post. This time I had two dead pigeons to check the situation. It is:
On broadleaf forest on very fresh carrion I collected C.loewi, when the carrion became older it replaced by C.vomitoria. Another Calliphoridae - Lucillia ampullacea was common either on fresh or old carrion.
Carrion near sea beach attracted C.vomitoria, L.ampullacea, L.illustris and a hell lot of Ch.albiceps
So, I regard ID of C.loewi as confirmed

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Excellent! Let's get those pictures in the gallery. B)