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http://www.flickr...162469102/

The photo was taken a few moments ago in Valega (35 km South of Oporto and very near of portuguese coast) - PORTUGAL

Thank you!

Jorge Almeida

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That looks like an ichneumon - order Hymenoptera :)

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Ichenumonidae, Hymenoptera, but not Ichneumon or Ichneumoninae I think.

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So what could it be? Possible genus... can you know just with the photographic information available?


Thank you.

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Well, this photo looks very like a specimen I have labelled here as Amblyjoppa fuscipennis (Order Hymenoptera, Family Ichneumonidae), which I believe in England is a fairly distinctive species. BUT ( and this is a very, very big 'but' ) this identification carries a very big warning: Parasitic Hymenoptera (which includes the Ichneumonidae) are a very large group with many very similar species, identifiable only using complex keys and a good microscope. So, use this identification with caution - especially considering how far away from England you are ;)

Amblyjoppa fuscipennis is apparently a parasitoid of Small Elephant Hawkmoth (Deilephila porcellus)

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My Amblyjoppa fuscipennis is very similar to the pic but has black femora and entirely pale tibia whereas these are banded. I only have a female and this may be a sex difference. Amblyjoppa attentatoria (Kuzin 1950) from Russia only seems unlikely and I have no idea what it looks like.The only other Western Palaearctic species of this (so far as I know too) distictive genus is Amblyjoppa proteus' It is mostly black. Complex keys indeed Impossible without specimens.How big was it Mine is about 2cmm long. Robert Nice ich nice photo

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Photo Ichneumon abdomen red and tibiae 3X banded with white= no Ichneumoninae for my!

Wings very dark, and species very large (2cm minimun ): A. fuscipennis!

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Just a little more than 1 cm.
So there is yet doubts, some says Amblyjoppa others says it is not Ichnomeinae... Come on with more opinions, please.

Thank you.

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So what do you think that Ichneumonidae could be? Another question: is any site with some images and key who can help us for a try? At least for determining genus. Thank you.

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I think there is a little confusion here - a few Ich* words have been used, which you might not be familiar with:
* Ichneumonoidea = a superfamily
* Ichneumonidae = a family
* Ichneumoninae = a subfamily
* Ichneumonini = a tribe
* Ichneumon = a genus

So, genus Amblyjoppa is in: superfamily Ichneumonoidea; family Ichneumonidae; subfamily Ichneumoninae. But NOT tribe Ichneumonini and certainly not genus Ichneumon. Amblyjoppa (in my books) is actually in tribe Protichneumonini. :)

As for online keys, that is very very unlikely. Most of the keys to the parasitic hymenoptera are very old, very out of date and were published many years ago - though you can still find them if you go to a good entomological library. But remember you must spend a long time keying a specimen through before you'll get an identification. :o

You might be able to find some images out on the web (though I couldn't find any) but, as I said before, there are very many species that look similar so images are a very bad way to identify most parasitic hymenoptera. ;)

Sorry to sound so pesimistic but I have done a fair bit of work with parasitic hymenoptera and I know they are one of the hardest groups for a beginner to get in to. :(

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The family is d?termined with wing : form areola is required,

The petiole, view lateral is required,

for one first sorting!

Very sorry!