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Diptera.info :: Identification queries :: Diptera (adults)
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Ectophasia oblonga?
johnes81
#1 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 14:51
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Location: Berlin, Germany
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I wish to re-evaluate my understanding of Ectophasia.
I have identified an Ectophasia as oblonga based upon keys of Tschorsnig.

According to Tschorsnig, the longitudinal stripe should be a maximum of 1/8 of the abdomen width.
The abdomen should be longer than wide.

I am confused about the color. I think that the species in my photo is orange not yellow.
But if you compare it to the color red, then it is more yellow. Does color really matter?

I would like confirmation that the species in my photo is indeed oblonga.
Otherwise, I will assume that I am misunderstanding Tschorsnig's keys or his keys are not accurate.
johnes81 attached the following image:


[231.73Kb]
John and Nini
 
Piluca_Alvarez
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Posted on 12-08-2017 15:03
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This is one of those cases that confuse me a lot and I have found several times. A female-looking male? Look the wing-markings, they are of a female. However the abdomen is not of a typical female. I believe male-looking females do exist. What I really need is a lesson about this problem. I have never found anything about it in my literature Sad
Edited by Piluca_Alvarez on 12-08-2017 15:03
 
johnes81
#3 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 15:07
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yes, this is a male in my opinion. I've labelled it a male. I had trouble at first but I agree that overall it is a male. Very strange one to me too.

I spent an entire night reading Tschorsnigs keys to id this one. I conclude that it must be oblonga. Now I wonder if I am correct?
John and Nini
 
Piluca_Alvarez
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Posted on 12-08-2017 15:10
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Simply wait for Theo Wink I am very looking forward to what he has to say about these problem. It has been bothering me for quite a long time.
 
johnes81
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Posted on 12-08-2017 15:16
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I agree. We wait for Theo. I lack the experience here.
I figured this to be oblonga because of the haustellum, 1/8 longitudinal stripe, abdomen is oblong. I could be wrong. I'd love to know more about this problem. I am confused now Smile

I will wait for Theo and sip some coffee. I will look through more photos ...
John and Nini
 
Zeegers
#6 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 16:03
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For starters, this is a female or a feminine male ... so all male features are out.
I can tell the difference only by genitalia....

Theo
 
johnes81
#7 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 16:27
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feminine male is interesting. Hopefully photos of genitalia have been published.

I should be able to collect Ectophasia throughout August. Maybe next year I will come across another feminine male or odd female. I will definitely collect it, then dissect it.

Thank You.
John and Nini
 
johnes81
#8 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 16:31
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For me, I think that genitalia is the only road to follow. Too many problems exist without genitalia. I will just assume that I need genitalia for everything. I suppose that I will learn more this way. Plus, it will give me a chance to photograph genitalia of both males and females for everything. I'm going to stop trying to id using keys. Too many problems.
John and Nini
 
Zeegers
#9 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 19:14
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Location: Soest, NL
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You made a simple mistake using the key, you learn from it. Don't give up so easily ! 92 % of the Tachinidae can benidentified without genitalia.
However, it cannot be learned in one week. I started 32 years ago....


Theo
 
johnes81
#10 Print Post
Posted on 12-08-2017 20:01
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Thank You, Theo. I am just angry with myself for making errors. I try hard to get it correct. In this case, I pushed myself too much for that one more photo. The species flew and I was unable to collect it. I hate it when I need a specimen and don't have one. I will move on. Next time I will examine the species through the lens to determine if I need to collect it. Otherwise, I'll key it out.

32 years? You are the Supreme Being Dipterist. I am lucky that you give me the time of day. Thank You very much for not treating me like an idiot. You are Wonderful!
John and Nini
 
Christine Devillers
#11 Print Post
Posted on 13-08-2017 10:01
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Are there features that could help to see the difference between female and male gynaecomorph of Ectophasia ?

Can females of Ectophasia have large claws like those of male ?
Are there no difference in the shape of the tip of abdomen ?

Christine
 
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16.12.17 15:08
If you know of any useful key(s) to the families of Diptera in the PUPAL stage, please send e-mail (spies@zi.biologie
.uni-muenchen.de) or post references here. Thank you Martin Spies

15.12.17 14:01
Danke Paul

12.12.17 12:36
Thorax black, somewhat shiny, with sparse dark grey dusting.

12.12.17 11:24
Thorax schwarz, etwas glänzend, mit spärlicher dunkelgrauer Bereifung Hallo, can anyone help translate the word Bereifung, I get tyre which of course doesn't fit Thx

20.11.17 15:09
Pls sign to help save Botanophila fonsecai https://home.38deg
rees.org.uk/?s=Fon
seca. Thx

17.11.17 14:22
Thanks Paul, interesting point

16.11.17 13:44
'Holding' might not be the perfect description. Apparently the armature makes contact with sensitive places on the female, coaxing her to agree to mate.

16.11.17 13:43
Is was not quite sure whether the word would apply correctly, but, yes, that is okay.

15.11.17 11:29
How about armature, would that fit? based on http://onlinelibra
ry.wiley.com/doi/1
0.1111/j.1365-3113
.2008.00422.x/pdf
it would seem that these spines etc are used to hold the female!

14.11.17 09:22
All spines, ridges, lobes, etc. on the femur.

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