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Diptera.info :: Identification queries :: Diptera (adults)
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Tachinid
oceanlis2000
#1 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 11:33
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Location: Wales, UK
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Found quite late 03_09_11 in mid-Wales, any help appreciated, quite a beastie this one!
oceanlis2000 attached the following image:


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Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
oceanlis2000
#2 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 11:33
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Location: Wales, UK
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2
oceanlis2000 attached the following image:


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Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
oceanlis2000
#3 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 11:34
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Location: Wales, UK
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oceanlis2000 attached the following image:


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Edited by oceanlis2000 on 03-11-2011 11:35
Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
sd
#4 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 13:29
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Location: Suffolk, UK
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At first I thought Hubneria (!), but then I remembered Exorista grandis - the only UK Exorista with hairy eyes and it is recorded for Wales. Wait for other's opinions thoughSmile

Steve
Edited by sd on 03-11-2011 13:29
 
ChrisR
#5 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 14:09
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Looks like a Carcelia to me Smile
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
sd
#6 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 14:12
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Location: Suffolk, UK
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or maybe its Carcelia with dark legs, doing id's from photos is hardGrin
Steve
 
sd
#7 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 14:13
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aargh, Chris beat me to my correctionAngry
 
ChrisR
#8 Print Post
Posted on 03-11-2011 15:01
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Well, there are only a few genera with eyes that large ... Carcelia/Senometopia (hairy eyes) and Thecocarcelia (bare eyes) Smile
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
oceanlis2000
#9 Print Post
Posted on 07-11-2011 11:24
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Location: Wales, UK
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Thanks for the tips on ID I’ve had a look through the gallery and have come up with the following:
Would be grateful for any additions or corrections

Sub Genus_Carcelia
6 species

Carcelia atricosta
No information

Carcelia bombylans
Discounted: No yellow dusting esp. on thorax
- What is the colour of the basicosta in this species? I get the impression from a posting by Matt Smith that’s it’s not black?
Carcelia gnava
Discounted- orange sides patches on T3 and no black bristles

Carcelia lucorum
Looks good Smile

Carcelia puberula
Discounted- orange sides patches on T3, tibiae orange-black

Carcelia rasa
Discounted-Tibiae orange-black

Sub Genus_Euryclea
1 species
Carcelia tibialis
Discounted- orange wing bases, orange hairs on occiput, t3 with orange patches

Senometopia
3 species

Senometopia excisa
t3 with orange patches

Senometopia intermedia
No information

Senometopia pollinosa
Bristle pattern on abdomen different
Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
ChrisR
#10 Print Post
Posted on 07-11-2011 15:16
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Body colour (especially presence of orange abdominal side patches) is a bit variable but the dusting colour and colour of the humeral callus is fairly stable. I would agree that this doesn't like bombylans or puberula ... things like gnava/atricosta/laxifrons are very rare (laxifrons only occurs around Brown-tail moth). My guess would be lucorum too ... based on look & rarity Smile

But Carcelia really do need checking under a microscope because they are not the easiest genus Wink
Edited by ChrisR on 07-11-2011 15:17
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
Larry Shone
#11 Print Post
Posted on 07-11-2011 15:32
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Crikey these Tachinids have big eyes!!
 
http://inventedeye.blogspot.com
oceanlis2000
#12 Print Post
Posted on 08-11-2011 11:17
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Thanks Chris and Larry

Another difficult genus!
Have you ever seen Carcelia atricosta?
Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
ChrisR
#13 Print Post
Posted on 08-11-2011 12:36
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I have 1 Carcelia atricosta but the identifications of Carcelia require close examination ... male genitalia and frons/eye width ratios are pretty reliable Smile
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
oceanlis2000
#14 Print Post
Posted on 05-12-2011 12:11
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Location: Wales, UK
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Thanks Chris

Do you have any photos of Carcelia atricosta anywhere?, just looked on the new TRS!
Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
ChrisR
#15 Print Post
Posted on 05-12-2011 13:07
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Not yet but they look pretty much the same as the others in their group - they can only really be confirmed reliably on male genitalia and very careful measurement of the frons width Wink
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
Zeegers
#16 Print Post
Posted on 05-12-2011 17:45
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It is a Carcelia, though the tibiae are pretty dark, if you look closely, they are reddish indeed.

It does resemble C. lucorum, given the discal setae.
I would not know why this species would be so rare in UK, its host is not (Arctia caja).

Theo
 
oceanlis2000
#17 Print Post
Posted on 06-12-2011 12:26
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Location: Wales, UK
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Thanks Theo

I had no idea it was rare, I wondered about the discal setae

Out of interest what are frons/eye width ratios of atricosta and lucorum, should be possible to discount one of them from the photos here?
Dr Elisabeth A. Harris
@FloraConsUK
 
sd
#18 Print Post
Posted on 06-12-2011 13:35
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I think there's a little confusion here about "rarity". When Chris said his determination was aided by rarity he meant lucorum is one of the least rare Carcelia - ie lucorum is one of the most common Carcelia in the UKSmile

Steve
 
ChrisR
#19 Print Post
Posted on 06-12-2011 14:29
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Yes, sorry if there was any confusion ... lucorum is about the commonest Carcelia in the UK. C.atricosta is one of the rarest Wink
Manager of the UK Species Inventory in the Angela Marmont Centre for UK Biodiversity at the Natural History Museum, London.
 
http://tachinidae.org.uk
Zeegers
#20 Print Post
Posted on 06-12-2011 21:49
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Location: Soest, NL
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ah, my mistake.

It can not be atricosta, given the discal setae (or seta-like hairs) on tergites. Given what you have in the UK, it should be lucorum.


Theo
 
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